Nedelin was a part of the millitary rocketry program, not the space program. If you want to include Nedelin, then the ICBM disasters in the US should also be included. The space programs and ICBM programs were very closely related on both sides, but if we strictly keep it to the space program the soviets were safer.

[–] ChairmanMeow@programming.dev 5 points 2 months ago (2 children)

ICBMs are spaceflight rockets, imo it's best to count them. The US hasn't had such large accidents with ICBMs, mostly minor ones.

Even if we exclude those it's not true. The US has sent significantly more people into space than the Soviets did, so NASAs accident rate was lower (hence safer), even if the absolute number of deaths was higher.

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 10 points 2 months ago

Spaceflight rockets are ICBMs, if we are being pedantic. The space program was the civilian-facing part of the broader rocketry programs.

Either way, if we exclude them, it is still true, but you can also measure by ratio. It just goes to show that you can manipulate real data to be presented in any way you want, and add or subtract context as needed for your angle.

[–] Bloomcole@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago

They wouldn't even get there without Russian engines.

[–] RaivoKulli@sopuli.xyz 0 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Did they have a comparable number of people sent to space?

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 5 points 2 months ago

During the space race, sure, from what I can find.

[–] Ilovethebomb@sh.itjust.works -1 points 2 months ago (2 children)

I've got this goober tagged as "tankie" in my app, they're quite steadily pro Russian.

[–] Diva@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 months ago

I’ve got this goober tagged as “tankie” in my app

lmao

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

I'm a Marxist, sure, very openly so. I don't really think anyone cares about who you've sniffed out to be a commie or not, especially considering I have it plastered all over my profile and frequently outright state it. I wouldn't say "pro-Russian," either, the Russian Federation is deeply flawed and has tragically fallen from their far more progressive Soviet heritage.

I'm very anti-NATO, like the vast majority of Marxists, and I don't fall for the hysteria around the Russian Federation as some ultimate evil, though, so if that's all it takes to be "pro-Russian" for you then that's funny.

[–] Ilovethebomb@sh.itjust.works -2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

So, you're pro Russian, but smart enough to not outright say it. Because they certainly do a lot of evil stuff.

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Being anti-NATO and not falling for the current hysteria that overplays the negative aspects of the RF and underplays the negative aspects of NATO-aligned countries is being "pro-Russian?" I'm far more willing to say I'm pro-PRC, or pro-Cuba, than I would be to say I'm pro-Russian, but I do understand that a lot of countries I support, like Burkina Faso, do rely quite a bit on the RF, and if the RF fell, the west would have a much stronger position in terrorizing the global south.

[–] Diva@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

they already hit the independent thought alarm years ago https://lemmy.nz/post/1227237 i-cant

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 2 points 2 months ago

Incredible, lmao.

[–] Psythik@lemmy.world -5 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Fewer human lives—sure, if you only include verified deaths—but the Soviet space program had considerably more deaths overall once you factor in other animals.

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 6 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Not actually true, both sides used animal testing.

[–] Psythik@lemmy.world 3 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

I know this. NASA’s animal fatalities were fewer and less often.

Sources:

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 9 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Both sides sent animals into space, and many didn't return. Animal testing in particular isn't something unknown to science, nor was it done out of intentional cruelty nor for the purpose of profits, like the cosmetics industry. I feel like you're narrowing in on something that ultimately isn't an equivalent comparison, especially when compared to the scale of the food industry and its systematized mass brutality every second of every day.

[+] Psythik@lemmy.world -7 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Cite your sources please. Without verifiable sources, you're just making shit up.

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 5 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Am I making up that the US sent animals into space? What claim do you think I'm making up? I already linked my source 2 comments ago.