Wow amazing, industrialization lifts people out of poverty... never would have realized. The problem with China is that currently, akin to the later stages of the USSR, they're only redistributing the wealth insofar as that means reprivatizing and consolidating in new hands, not actually redistributing from the wealthy minority to the majority, but creating a new wealthy minority.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 8 points 7 months ago (1 children)

Weird how industrialization isn't lifting people out of poverty in places like India the same way. Wonder what might be different. Maybe a smarty pants such as yourself could enlighten us. 🤔

[–] GiveMemes@jlai.lu -2 points 7 months ago* (last edited 7 months ago) (1 children)

A far right corporatocratic government that makes exactly zero effort to help the people? I'm not saying China is exclusively bad. The USSR was the only 'country' able to successfully play catch up with the west industrially. The problem is when the authoritarian government get old, realize they don't own anything to secure their families' continued lavish lifestyle, and reprivatize. I literally went to school with a guy whose grandpa was pals with Mao. Guess whose family is now worth billions and lives a lavish lifestyle in a mansion in Northern China?

I'm not trying to argue socialism is bad, just that it can't be achieved by an authoritarian government to significant effect.

That's where the value of democratically achieved socialism comes in, but it would have to be somewhere with an incredibly secure democracy and secure economic status, as the capitalist (elite) forces from outside and within will always work to destroy/impede socialism.

[–] yogthos@lemmy.ml 2 points 7 months ago

A far right corporatocratic government that makes exactly zero effort to help the people?

meanwhile in the real world https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2022/04/01/lifting-800-million-people-out-of-poverty-new-report-looks-at-lessons-from-china-s-experience

The problem is when the authoritarian government get old, realize they don’t own anything to secure their families’ continued lavish lifestyle, and reprivatize.

Authoritarian is a nonsensical term, every government holds authority by virtue of having the monopoly on violence, the only question is whose interests the government serves.

I literally went to school with a guy whose grandpa was pals with Mao. Guess whose family is now worth billions and lives a lavish lifestyle in a mansion in Northern China?

again, welcome to the real world https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25495509/

That’s where the value of democratically achieved socialism comes in, but it would have to be somewhere with an incredibly secure democracy and secure economic status, as the capitalist (elite) forces from outside and within will always work to destroy/impede socialism.

China already has democratic socialism. Only westerners pretend otherwise.