Linux

48287 readers

638 users here now

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Linux is a family of open source Unix-like operating systems based on the Linux kernel, an operating system kernel first released on September 17, 1991 by Linus Torvalds. Linux is typically packaged in a Linux distribution (or distro for short).

Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word "Linux" in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.

Rules

Posts must be relevant to operating systems running the Linux kernel. GNU/Linux or otherwise.
No misinformation
No NSFW content
No hate speech, bigotry, etc

Related Communities

Community icon by Alpár-Etele Méder, licensed under CC BY 3.0

founded 5 years ago

MODERATORS

AgreeableLandscape@lemmy.ml

nooter692@lemmy.ml

MarcellusDrum@lemmy.ml

cypherpunks@lemmy.ml

cyclohexane@lemmy.ml

d3Xt3r@lemmy.nz

510

One Of The Rust Linux Kernel Maintainers Steps Down - Cites "Nontechnical Nonsense" (www.phoronix.com)

submitted 2 months ago by pnutzh4x0r@lemmy.ndlug.org to c/linux@lemmy.ml

214 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Wedson Almeida Filho is a Microsoft engineer who has been prolific in his contributions to the Rust for the Linux kernel code over the past several years. Wedson has worked on many Rust Linux kernel features and even did a experimental EXT2 file-system driver port to Rust. But he's had enough and is now stepping away from the Rust for Linux efforts.

From Wedon's post on the kernel mailing list:

I am retiring from the project. After almost 4 years, I find myself lacking the energy and enthusiasm I once had to respond to some of the nontechnical nonsense, so it's best to leave it up to those who still have it in them.

...

I truly believe the future of kernels is with memory-safe languages. I am no visionary but if Linux doesn't internalize this, I'm afraid some other kernel will do to it what it did to Unix.

Lastly, I'll leave a small, 3min 30s, sample for context here: https://youtu.be/WiPp9YEBV0Q?t=1529 -- and to reiterate, no one is trying force anyone else to learn Rust nor prevent refactorings of C code."

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments

[–] troed@fedia.io -3 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Do you believe C isn't crap when it comes to security? Please explain why and I'll happily debate you.

/fw hacker, reverse engineer

[–] Duke_Nukem_1990@feddit.org 0 points 2 months ago (1 children)

That's not how it works. You said:

C is crap for anything where security matters.

Argue for your point.

[–] troed@fedia.io 3 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Figure 2: https://sci-hub.se/https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11416-021-00379-x

[–] zaphod@sopuli.xyz 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Lots of categories which Rust doesn't prevent, and in the kernel you'll end up with a lot of unsafe Rust, so it can't guarantee memory-safety in all cases.

[–] loudwhisper@infosec.pub 5 points 2 months ago

The biggest items on the graph are all out of bounds accesses, use-after-free and overflows. It is undeniable that memory safe languages help reducing vulnerabilities, we know for decades that memory corruption vulnerabilities are both the most common and the most severe in programs written in memory-unsafe languages.

Unsafe rust is also not turning off every safety feature, and it's much better to have clear highlighted and isolated parts of code that are unsafe, which can be more easily reviewed and tested, compared to everything suffering from those problems.

I don't think there is debate here, rewriting is a huge effort, but the fact that using C is prone to memory corruption vulnerabilities and memory-safe languages are better from that regard is a fact.

[–] Duke_Nukem_1990@feddit.org -4 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Link dropping is also not arguing.

[–] troed@fedia.io 5 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Citing scientific research is. Now, please post your gut feeling in response.

[–] the_post_of_tom_joad@sh.itjust.works 8 points 2 months ago

My gut feeling is you didn't hook a programmer but a debate pervert (maybe shouldn't have dropped the D word lol). Some people hear that word and turn they minds off cuz debates are simply a game for them to win. I'd just let this one swim brother