this post was submitted on 18 Sep 2024
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Can someone show me on a map where "the west" starts?
It's the big blob of central capitalism from when colonialism started to now. It's where the genocidal whites live, hence why Israel plays in the European soccer league.
I'm not feeling too genocidal at the moment and I'm not too sure what a big blob of capitalism looks like but it sounds like you are impugning me (int al) in some way.
If you are going to deliver a stinging attack on something you dislike, why not deploy an impassioned and pithy argument rather than ... that. You do at least manage to spell it's correctly, which is nice.
Next time you aren't sure whether someone is being hostile or mean to you, just hold back on what your hypothetical response would be until you're sure what the intent was.
In my case I was earnestly answering the question. "The West" describes that continuation of institutional power which I described as a blob.
Ah, so even though they're (trying to) occupy the exact same plot of land, Israel is "the west" (and therefore we're obligated to hate it) and Palestine is not (and therefore we're not). That makes sense now!
None of that makes sense. You don't have the writing chops to pull off a sentence with three clauses and three additional parenthetical clauses.
We're obligated to hate Israel and not Palestine because Israel is the settler colonial project currently engaged in genocide. It's very simple and no one has been opaque about it.
Explaining to my Cherokee friends that, really, you're no better than the European settlers who displaced you because you both wanted to live in Florida. Suddenly, they're not my friends anymore. Can't believe they were anti-white racists the whole time.
Where should Israel go back to then? What other land does it have claim to where it should stay?
Ah, right. Of course. You don't think Israel should exist at all. Judging by this comment I'm guessing you don't think the US should exist either, which means I don't have to listen to you
Leftists often say that no one should have to justify their right to exist. Of course, they usually say it in regards to trans people and not cis white males, but they say it. And I kinda don't want to justify my right to exist.
Israel isn't a person. It can simply dissolve into nothing.
The people who moved there to take part in the land stealing can simply go back where they came. Or they can stay and live alongside the people they tried to genocide as equal citizens.
I'm sure the US government will be delighted to harbor all their war criminals above a certain station.
Israel doesn't have to go anywhere. No more than South Africa went somewhere after Apartheid ended in that state. Or Cuba vanished after the Batista government collapsed. Or Germany vanished after '45.
But the war criminals leading the current genocidal policy towards the people in their care. They need the same treatment as Milosoviec, Omar al-Bashir, and Saddam Hussein.
Drag Netanyahu to the Hague and prosecute him for crimes against humanity. Dismiss the current illegal and unconstitutional Kinesset and hold new free and fair elections in Israel. Provide reparations for the displaced Gaza and West Bank citizens, and launch a Truth and Reconciliation Committee to recover damages for the crimes committed against them.
That is the only moral path forward for Israel.
Not the person you're responding to
Obviously Israel shouldn't exist at all. It's not a diplomatically expedient thing to say, but it's the only real anti-colonialist answer because Israel is actively a colony. That doesn't mean expelling all the Jews from Palestine -- it might shock you to know there are non-Israeli Jews currently in Palestine -- but it does mean that the proper boarders for Palestine are restored and thus that there is no ethnostate (Jewish or otherwise). Recent additions to the Israeli colony (for they are always recruiting) can be sent back to their homelands. Many of them have been there long enough that they have no connection to those homelands anymore (including the more direct descendants of Holocaust survivors, etc.) and they can stay on the land that was Israel, but a lot of them are only there because they like the Jewish ethnostate thing and will therefore flee of their own will. That volume of people fleeing will probably incite still more to flee, but some will remain and they should be treated humanely and as equal citizens, prosecuting whatever crimes they committed but not being treated like subhumans the way that Israelis treated Palestinian prisoners.
The US is a much more difficult question because unlike Israelis being a minority compared to Palestinians, there are many more Euro-Americans, etc than there are Native Americans because the genocidal project of the US is much more complete. Inevitably some land, the land recently taken and some of the more useful land than what the Natives have been left with, should be returned to them, but obviously deporting all the Euros, etc. is neither viable nor productive, like how (to a much, much smaller extent) deporting all the Israelis is neither viable nor productive.
That said, separate from demographics and land rights, the US government absolutely shouldn't exist because it is terrorizing the world, including through proxies like Israel.