100%. It's far more exhausting talking to these "ultra-leftists" that operate more on vibes than Matetialism than it is to speak with liberals about AES, in my experience. It's intellectual anti-intellectualism, Marxist Anti-Marxism.

[–] TheOubliette@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 month ago

Often, yeah. Some of these people are just straight-up liberals that refuse to read but have a compulsion to confidently share opinions and pick fights in spite of this. I think this is actually the most common form of Western "Marxist" that one encounters irl. The person that thinks their contribution to the leftist cause is to join a space and share their half-baked opinion. Usually a white cis dude and I don't think that's a coincidence lol. They're brought up in that culture.

Buy yeah there are definitely ultras as well. I dunno I have had decent luck in pulling them away from that tendency. My sample is biased because, among other things, it draws from people attempting to do real organizing work and who are somewhat realistic about it, so they are more open to some "campism" like, "sure we can internally criticize China, but externally we must understand that we would only be feeding into imperialist propaganda domestically". I have had noticeably less luck trying that with MLMs that are basically just a reading group that occasionally joins (and picks fights with lol) coalitions.

Honestly, in my experience the people with the best natural instincts for this are those doing principled anti-imperialist work. They are open to mutual learning, political education, and constructive self-criticism as a means for org development. I have had better luck with anarchists in such orgs than with self-proclaimed communists doing labor or electoral work.