no, im a linux user. if someone doesnt want to dedicate time to adopt and learn, linux isnt "easier". even if linux was as easy as windows (idk it can even be compared tbh); its different. different requires time and effort, if someone cant do that (for any reason, this isnt a judgement), its not an easy move.

[–] curbstickle@anarchist.nexus 41 points 3 months ago (3 children)

My wife is not technical and has no interest in adopting and learning anything.

The web works the same way regardless of the OS, and LibreOffice has all the same features as Word that she uses.

The "hard part" is choosing and upgrading hardware, and maybe installation (depending on distribution).

I mention this because I think we should evaluate these differently. With a preloaded desktop/laptop, I've had no issues with anyone that actually relates to Linux (except my BIL who was trying to build an arcade stick for gaming).

Explaining to my other BIL how to select hardware for his custom build, that took some time, as did guiding him through the installation.

[–] Unknown_0671@lemmy.blahaj.zone 20 points 3 months ago (3 children)

im sorry but LibreOffice might have all the features of word but it certainly has a really bad user experience. i write often and libreoffice writer is difficult to say the least, not because of lack of features but a lack of most 'little things' and 'tweaks'. i can definitely see someone switching to libreoffice from word, but saying its not 'hard' is untrue or a biased take in my opinion and using both suites (more familiar with libre though lmao).

i do agree that for a mostly web based user as is commonplace nowadays, a preloaded linux thats been decently built is gonna be a significantly easy switch.

on a slight tangent, but linux for me was a way to rebuild my love for computers after windows systematically fucked things. and i really enjoy the learning process. so personally i still encourage people to spend the time in the learning process atleast a bit

[–] curbstickle@anarchist.nexus 30 points 3 months ago (1 children)

i write often and libreoffice writer is difficult to say the least, not because of lack of features but a lack of most ‘little things’ and ‘tweaks’.

I think you're missing the fact that you are doing more 'expert' things than most here. The majority of the time, my wife opens a document she made once, saves as a new file (no, she's not using templates - don't get me started), and writes her invoice. She then PDFs it and sends it via email.

She does the same thing with Calc and a previously made blank "monthly calendar". Opens the blank, saves for the client, enters in the days and renames the month at the top, notes what she'll be doing for them on each day with an hour estimate, PDF and email.

That is the kind of thing most people do.

[–] Unknown_0671@lemmy.blahaj.zone 40 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (3 children)

ah fuck, i did this

[–] curbstickle@anarchist.nexus 16 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I was seriously considering posting it but didn't want you to think I was being a dick about it 😀

[–] Unknown_0671@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 points 3 months ago (1 children)

appreciated, reality checks are best served plain

load more comments (1 replies)

load more comments (2 replies)

[–] Natanox@discuss.tchncs.de 16 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Yeah, LibreOffice stuck with the old UI/UX for better and worse. Luckily we do have a nice selection of Office Suites in addition to them. OnlyOffice, WPS Office, Collabora, KDE Calligra, Softmaker Office… surely there's one for everyone on Linux.

Personally I like OnlyOffice.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] Grumpy@sh.itjust.works 8 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I would say give onlyoffice a try. It's not FOSS but does have free tier for home use and it's what I go to for non-main work computer. Beats libre imo.

load more comments (1 replies)

load more comments (2 replies)

[–] CileTheSane@lemmy.ca 32 points 3 months ago (4 children)

You need to dedicate time to adopt and learn how to get a local account on Windows and clear out the bullshit you don't want.

I recently switched to Linux. At first I was surprised at how easy it was to set up and get working, then I was annoyed at having to look up how to do every little thing I know how to do on Windows and considered switching back.

Then I booted into Windows and in less than 10 minutes was fed up the whole OS. I realized I had to look up things just as often as I was on Linux, but in Linux it was because I didn't know where it was, where as on Windows it was actively hidden from me and fighting me every step of the way.
Windows is in no way easier, It's just the struggle you've gotten so used to fighting with every single day that you've forgotten it exists.

load more comments (4 replies)

[–] wheezy@lemmy.ml 24 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I don't disagree in general. However, my mom has been running Linux with a Windows XP skin for almost 8 years now without knowing she's using Linux. Literally just keeps her from running a random .exe and she does everything on a browser anyway.

[–] jcarax@beehaw.org 7 points 3 months ago

In my experience, it's usually power users or basic users with very specific application requirements, who have trouble moving between operating systems. There's usually a FOSS alternative to those applications, but often requires reworking a workflow or upskilling more than they want to. But they're still basic users so it's more a speed bump than a road block.

So yeah, most people can switch to MacOS without an issue, and the vast majority of those can switch to a distro like Fedora or Ubuntu and quickly feel comfortable.

Power users get stuck in this situation where they've learned how to do advanced things in Windows, have things tweaked to support more complex and peculiar workflows, but often don't understand the actual concepts behind them. And even if they do understand the concepts, they still have to learn the alternatives in a new OS, and rebuild their workflows. Now, there's a lot more ability to learn behind the scenes about the why and how with Linux and BSD, so I'd argue they'd be better off to just suck it up and get started, and they'll be better off before long.

[–] Unknown_0671@lemmy.blahaj.zone 21 points 3 months ago (1 children)

and i also say this as someone who is required to use windows at work. i despise windows, its so much harder for me to use windows given linux been my daily driver for a long time. im annoyed at powershell, explorer, clunky shortcut behaviors, etc just about every second im on windows. its a nightmare difficulty for me, but i also refuse to ever relearn windows stuff. i do remember a time when it wasnt annoying as fuck to use, could be nostalgia or that people just adopt.

using windows as a linux user is a nightmare. but if someone is adopted to windows, the opposite is gonna be similar no matter what.

[–] 7U5K3N@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 3 months ago (5 children)

I also use windows for work. Shits stupid. Search in the start bar for an app that's installed on your PC? Let's open edge and show you web results. Want to copy something out of teams? Here's a copilot link you just accidentally clicked. Thanks for accepting that TOS.

I'd love some say on my work computer but alas I'm a grunt.

load more comments (5 replies)

[–] Chais@sh.itjust.works 16 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Well, the whole reason people have to "adopt and learn" is because M$ bought their way onto virtually every new PC sold back in the 90s, so people's first experience would be their "operating system."
Talk about leveraging anchoring bias.
I'd argue you'd have a hard time selling Windows to people if you were honest about it.

For just 145€ you get:

an operating system that assumes you're an inept idiot

ads in your application launcher

a screenshot taken every minute, which gets stored outside your control and analysed by "AI"

an invasive "assistant" that listens in on your microphone at all times

forced to create an account to log in to "your" machine, so we can collect even more personal data

Especially when the alternative is free and let's you do whatever you want with your hardware. And if you happen to misconfigure something you get to be an adult about it and learn from your mistakes.

[–] Unknown_0671@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 points 3 months ago

oh im not disagreeing with that. windows is not easy to learn (as i said in my comment response to my comment above) after u stop being used to it. i doubt its easier if u are new to it either. they definitely just bought their way into making it the status quo. like how chrome did with browsing the web. or google with gmail. or google with etc etc.

what i am saying is that ignoring the "adopt and learn" part isnt benefiting anyone

[–] ayyy@sh.itjust.works 8 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I don’t think you realize just how complicated it has become to administer windows these days.

load more comments (1 replies)

load more comments (5 replies)

[–] 42beansinapod@discuss.tchncs.de 12 points 3 months ago

I am a Linux user, I dual boot Kubuntu and Windows.

On Friday I bought a new game on steam, checked on protondb and it is platinum, tried to launch it and it failed. I tried 4 different proton compatability modes and it failed to launch each time. While I am a sysadmin and am well capable of troubleshooting it, I really just wanted to play that game so I rebooted into windows.

If I hadn't had that other win11 SSD in my machine, I would have had to not play that game because I had no energy to troubleshoot that on a friday night after fighting with linux all day at work.

Tldr: some times Linux is a seemless as Windows, but not always, even when it is supposed to be and is for others. Even if you have that activate windows watermark.

load more comments (66 replies)

[–] HouseWolf@pawb.social 64 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (2 children)

From the devs Github

KMS38 has now been removed from the MAS script. Users are advised to use HWID or TSforge activation instead.

So you can still activate Windows through the other means in the script already. I dunno the ins n' outs, of what makes one method better than another. When I checked it seemed HWID was the first option and the one most people use anyway sooooo...

[–] theangriestbird@beehaw.org 28 points 3 months ago

You're right, but still. Reduction of options is never good for the community.

[–] Lolen10@lemmy.dbzer0.com 28 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Here are the differences between the methods: https://massgrave.dev/chart

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] Ceruleum@lemmy.wtf 27 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Windows has become too shitty to pay for. And now they do this.

[–] Engywuck@lemmy.zip 13 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Always has been.

[–] Ildsaye@hexbear.net 8 points 3 months ago (2 children)

astronaut-1

[–] Engywuck@lemmy.zip 6 points 3 months ago

Thanks

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] Sir_Kevin@lemmy.dbzer0.com 26 points 3 months ago

One more reason never to install windows.

[–] SeeMarkFly@lemmy.ml 16 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Instead of FIXING the problem.

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] Harkronis@kbin.melroy.org 12 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Well, just in time for me to have activated my Windows 10 version so I'm good until 2032.

Never going to Windows 11, Microsoft, fuck you.

[–] Prove_your_argument@piefed.social 12 points 3 months ago

Try Linux lately?

If your use case is general computing, gaming or whatnot, it’s in a great state today.

[–] aReallyCrunchyLeaf@lemmy.ml 11 points 3 months ago (1 children)

load more comments (1 replies)

[–] SabinStargem@lemmy.today 8 points 3 months ago

I am waiting for SteamOS Desktop to be released before abandoning Windows. Way I figure, that is the best way to get a 'casual' Linux, without scrimping on utility. Having Valve as the distro provider would also ensure that my flavor of Linux is stable, well supported, and documented.

[–] melroy@kbin.melroy.org 5 points 3 months ago (1 children)

What is Windows?

[–] LaGG_3@hexbear.net 8 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Those things that let light in your home, car, bus, train ,etc

load more comments (2 replies)

[–] hexagonwin@lemmy.sdf.org 5 points 3 months ago

i guess M$ is just deprecating that whole gatherosstate thing because of Y2k38, not exactly targeting MAS. If they are they would've removed their github repo and patched the hwid glitch.

load more comments