this post was submitted on 02 Jun 2026
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[–] greencoil@lemmy.frozeninferno.xyz 66 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

I thought this was going to be about the blatant Nazi posting, both in the community forums and and in asset flip/game spam in the store. Apparently the lawyer in question was bringing up accepting more censorship in the lead up to more pornographic content becoming available on Steam.

I don't typically care for Gabe, but yeah, I would have said the same thing. Probably not for the same reason tbf. But even if you don't have any political concerns outside of making money for your yacht collection... Hate speech isn't currently costing Valve money. Porn bans are directly effecting a market they have invested into. Why would you pay a legal expert to be so spineless?

[–] HarkMahlberg@kbin.earth 32 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Well, at the risk of repeating the obvious, what do you pay a legal expert for? As in, what did you hire them to do?

If you hired them to do research on current laws and regulations to see what you must abide by / can get away with, then you've paid them for information, even if its information you don't want to hear.

If you hired them to represent your interests, to argue your case in court for you as their client, then yeah you can't really have a lawyer that's wishy washy on your position. As stupid as they sound, that's what Trump's DOJ is doing at great risk to their own careers. Which is why more and more of them are resigning.

[–] greencoil@lemmy.frozeninferno.xyz 10 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 12 hours ago) (1 children)

Historically, Valve has hired lawyers to weasle out of legal responsibilities around the world, to limited success. They repeatedly tried to get out of legally mandated refunds for digital goods in several western nations, and now people think that Valve is the good guys for eventually capitulating like it was their idea in the first place.

I cannot imagine a scenario where Gabe Newell would hire a lawyer just to have him say "comply with the new laws instead of fighting back".

EDIT: Just cause I felt like it made for more present context, Valves legal team clearly isn't going to take the "maybe we should ban loot boxes as a form of online gambling targeted towards children" debate lying down. You mess with Valve's sources of revenue, they will pull out every possible slime ball argument to say they are legally allowed to piss over any and all consumer rights. Gabe's not about to allow porn to be banned on his store of "digital game license's where you don't own anything actually". Not until the legal situation gets so dire that porn isn't worth attempting to profit off anymore. He has fought far more tasteless battles in his career.

[–] doublah@sopuli.xyz 12 points 10 hours ago

People probably think Valve is the "good guy" in the case of refunds because they made it a worldwide policy after the Australia case. Other game platforms have only offered refunds explicitly where required. Hell, PlayStation gets away with no refunds almost anywhere if you've downloaded the game.

[–] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 266 points 19 hours ago* (last edited 19 hours ago) (19 children)

Good. Lawyers for companies are too quick to demand that you get rid of things that might make anyone slightly upset, and it ruins online places. It's why NSFW games went away, and why everything needs a thousand warnings. It's why companies are so happy to add age verification, because it "CYA"s them.

Good on Gabe there. That's your job, to protect the company if they get sued, not make content decisions

[–] Feathercrown@lemmy.world 52 points 16 hours ago (2 children)

To be fair, their job is also to recommend the course of action least likely to get Valve sued.

[–] Goodeye8@piefed.social 2 points 4 hours ago

No. Their job is to find the legal gray area to operate in so that if they get sued they're not instantly guaranteed to lose. Do you think Meta hires lawyers who tell them "maybe don't spy on people" instead of lawyers who will fight all the fines EU throws at their way? Companies don't hire lawyers just so they could say something can't be done, they're hired to find a way to get it done or find an irrefutable point why it can't be done. The fact that Valve did go ahead with the hands-off approach shows that the lawyer didn't do their job properly when they presented their opinion.

[–] MycelialMass@lemmy.world 8 points 14 hours ago

Only if they ask for that advice, presumably

[–] Fmstrat@lemmy.world 2 points 8 hours ago

Dont be too hard on this lawyer, though, as his advice has saved Valve big time in the past.

(If you're not familiar, there is a small amount of info about it in the article.)

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[–] Dojan@pawb.social 24 points 14 hours ago (2 children)

we got an anecdote from an anonymous former Valve employee of a time when Newell downright bit the head off Valve general counsel Karl Quackenbush

Quackenbush is a wild name.

[–] NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone 4 points 11 hours ago

He should at least have a proper American given name like Bront or Firehose.

[–] Aneorthisio@lemmy.ml 5 points 14 hours ago

I'm definitely writing that down for my next super scrabble with proper nouns at grandma's.

[–] Medic8eme@piefed.ca 19 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Billionaires should be extinct. Even GabeN.

[–] auzy1@lemmy.world 3 points 6 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago) (1 children)

So what are you doing about steam?

  1. Are you contributing to wine? Probably not
  2. Are you helping develop good gaming hardware.. nope
  3. Are you writing an alternative store? Nope
  4. Are you providing gaming libraries.. Nope
  5. Are you lobbying to defend gamers rights? Nope
  6. Are you testing games for Wine to maintain the AppDB? Probably nope
  7. Are you making it easy to distribute games on multiple platforms? Nope
  8. Are you helping small gaming developers add major features to their app with a few lines of code (such as multiplayer)? Nope

The reality is, Linux mainly at this time on the desktop is only succeeding still thanks to steam. If any other store were in charge (including GOG), we'd be still stuck in windows, or worse (a console like nintendo). If Steam wasn't available, I wouldn't feel comfortable using Linux for my main desktop (even though, I play all my games on a rog ally X)

Those of us who played games on Linux before Steam was available will tell you how painful it was. Steam changed things completely, and offered an experience that just works (tm). Steam will also no doubt be one of the single biggest driving forces to get ARM on Linux up to snuff (thanks to Steam Frame) with X86 compatibility, in particular performance

Even for those who have been on steam for a decade or longer, old games are STILL working, because they've maintained runtime libraries and such to assist with that.

Gabe didn't get to where he was by dodgy tactics. He got there by providing a service gamers want, and by running a tight ship. He also stays out of politics and from my understanding, is actually known for being a good guy too and is transparent (other than about HL3). Unlike other billionaires, he's also not booking out whole islands intrusively either for a wedding, to flaunt their money.

He's a billionaire sure.. but, the average pay at Steam is also far above average, so its not like he's exploiting labor. And unlike companies like Oracle, the working conditions seem to be far better too. And unlike modern Apple, Steam is about creating products which are good, not simply seem good (which I respect a lot).

[–] auzy1@lemmy.world 2 points 5 hours ago

Also, i'd add ironically, unless he blatantly gave away his money, the other option realistically would be to hire lots of developers to write games.. Which, would simply generate more income and turn them into a bigger monopoly..

[–] Krafting@lemmy.world 20 points 15 hours ago (1 children)

Valve being Valve... So they keep winning, Thank you Valve. Fuck everyone who wants to stop them when they do the right thing. Content moderation anywhere on the internet just feel like straight up censoring nowadays.

[–] minorkeys@sh.itjust.works 6 points 13 hours ago

Because it is. It's social engineering.

[–] koncertejo@lemmy.ml 47 points 19 hours ago (7 children)

I'm glad this was over what sort of games Steam sells and pushing back against payment processors, but the flipside to this is how Steam has far too lax moderation of its community forums as well (which is explicitly part of Gaben's position here). Billionaires aren't your friends, Gabe is politically a weird libertarian that people just happen to like, and Steam's community is one of its most toxic features.

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[–] missingno@fedia.io 58 points 19 hours ago (9 children)

Steam Forums are slowly devolving into one of the worst right-wing incubators because they refuse to proactively moderate. Any time a game gets declared a target by the post-Gamergate crowd, the boards become flooded with propaganda, and Valve does not care.

[–] Katana314@lemmy.world 1 points 10 minutes ago

Something I want Valve to work on is a “blocklist” feature like Bluesky.

Valve themselves are libertarian and don’t want to quash any voices they don’t need to, including negative ones. However, community members could decide “We are tired of anti-woke trolls whining about inclusion, and creating their own enemies for rage farming”; and then write a blocklist of said trolls, that many players choose to subscribe to, making those posts invisible.

Could even configure a blocklist to remove any players with a Steam level of 1, just to remove factory-made bot accounts.

[–] Mora@pawb.social 61 points 19 hours ago (4 children)

The forums are moderated (or in many cases not moderated) by the game publisher, not Steam. If they don't want to moderate they could technically close the forum for their game but very few publishers do so.

[–] BoneheadBruin@pawb.social 42 points 19 hours ago* (last edited 19 hours ago) (5 children)

Maybe they're supposed to be moderated by devs/publishers, but I'd guess as high as 99% of steam communities are unmoderated or simply auto moderated for specific slurs. Basically every game I've ever looked at has just piles of threads asking "Is ThIs GaMe WoKe???" or "PLEASE ADD LGBTQ2IABBQ+ CHARACTERS!!!" as award farming shitposts. Heaven forbid its a competitive game because those forums get rancid. It also happens I'm the discussion of basically every news update for any game with a remotely active community.

There is zero or nearly zero accountability for the state of the community hub and Valve simply saying "devs should do it" is just passing the buck.

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Pretty sure they can't close the forums, actually. I've never seen a Steam forum be outright disabled, despite seeing many devs/publishers who would absolutely close that down as a place of critique. I haven't even seen delisted but viewable games close down their forums from new posts. Are you sure Valve doesn't have an agreement with publishers that they are required to keep the forum open for their games?

The discussion I have seen from publishers is that the automated moderation on Steam is literally nonexistent from their end, and the global automation is far too lax. So they push their player base to platforms that are actually capable of dealing with problematic behavior.

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[–] nialv7@lemmy.world 7 points 16 hours ago (1 children)

It's complicated I guess. People often use the "Nazi bar" analogy and I kinda get it. But I am also conflicted. Yes I disagree with their opinions and wish they will stop having those opinions. But on the other hand moderating them will just make them move to somewhere else, and they will still be having those opinions, and arguably in a worse environment. Because it would be more of a bubble with nobody countering them.

[–] missingno@fedia.io 18 points 16 hours ago (4 children)

Forcing the most radical extremists underground won't deprogram them, but it will make it significantly more difficult for them to spread propaganda. The point of deplatforming is to shut down the pipeline so that fewer people get radicalized.

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[–] njm1314@lemmy.world 4 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

Gabe Newell could very very easily afford to pay for more moderation.

[–] doublah@sopuli.xyz 14 points 10 hours ago* (last edited 10 hours ago)

This kind of "moderation" (read: censoring adult content) is something he doesn't want.

[–] ImgurRefugee114@reddthat.com 30 points 18 hours ago* (last edited 18 hours ago) (1 children)

They should become a payment processor... I'd have a valve card. Hell, I wouldn't mind if it even had a relatively high cost at this point, just to say fuck you to visa/mc/amex

[–] Holytimes@sh.itjust.works 3 points 13 hours ago

Amex hasn't actually done any censoring so far as I'm aware. Its actually entirely just sorta sat out. Along with diner/discover.

Its just Visa and MasterCard.

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