this post was submitted on 31 Oct 2024
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[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 24 points 3 weeks ago (3 children)

Yes, but with a light and efficient vehicle, along with enough area covered in solar, it should be able to get you about 15 miles of free travel when left out on a sunny day. It has a battery. It isn't just running on sunshine and lollipops.

[–] ArtikBanana@lemmy.dbzer0.com 15 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)
[–] Ilovethebomb@lemm.ee 8 points 3 weeks ago

I'll believe that when I see it.

[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 6 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

I'm not believing they'll get even close to that in a production vehicle that's US street legal.

[–] ArtikBanana@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

The body weighs around 360kg, with a 60kwh battery it supposedly weighs around 800kg (the smallest and lightest option is 25kwh), with a drag coefficient of 0.13.
In comparison to some of the most efficient cars - the Hyundai Ioniq 6 is around 1,860kg with a drag coefficient of 0.21. Tesla Model 3 is around 1760kg with a drag coefficient of 0.219.

It's going to be a whole lot more efficient than the average car just based on these numbers.

Now it depends on how much of the car's surface will be covered by the solar panel and what's the panel's efficiency.

[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

The Honda civics in the 1980's weighed around 800 or so kg as well. You know one of the reasons they got heavier? Crash ratings and safety features.

So once again I'm calling bs that they will get 45 miles out of this. Even if they got it classified as a motorcycle and scape around the car safety requirements, it still won't get a real world 45 miles a day from solar charging. Your math will never add up to that.

[–] Blaster_M@lemmy.world 4 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

The Honda Civics of the 1980s did not have a drag coefficient below 0.2

[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 3 weeks ago

Come back in a year or so and we'll see who has to eat their words.

[–] ArtikBanana@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

That's a weird comparison to make. The Aptera is smaller and uses different materials.
Afaik it's going to be classified as a motorcycle in many states in the USA, but they're still aiming for a high rating. I know they have crumple zones and a safety cell made from composites akin to F1 cars.
Whether what they're planning will be enough, we'll only know for sure once they test it.

The math works quite well as long as the information is accurate.
Of course things can always turn up to be different in the end product.
But from the information we have now, ~4 hours of good sunlight conditions will be enough for 43 miles.

[–] invertedspear@lemm.ee 2 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

They are skirting the “street legal” and safety stuff by making an electric motorcycle instead of a car. Months (years?) ago I read something about how they are planning to tackle helmet laws in court because of this. Accident safety features are heavy, this thing is going to be a death trap on US roads in order to be as light as possible.

Overall I think that’s the right move, but I wouldn’t get in rush hour traffic in this thing.

[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 3 weeks ago

That'll help keep it as light as they're planning. They still won't get 45 miles a day on solar unless they're doing 15mph on a flat road in Nevada during the summer. No way would it be an expected rating.

[–] ramenshaman@lemmy.world 1 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

You should actually watch their videos and do some research before spewing your speculations. Seems like it's going to be pretty safe to me.

[–] invertedspear@lemm.ee 1 points 3 weeks ago

I’ve watched plenty of their videos. Despite how you took my message, I’m actually very excited and hope they make it to full production. But if you think that thing is going to be safe enough when some a-hole in a Tahoe t-bones you, you’re going to be very disappointed. The problem isn’t the Aptera, it’s the ridiculous sized SUVs already on the road.

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip -1 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

Yeah, this is why it's dumb. When is a parked car parked ideally to capture sunlight? Just put the money into solar panels on a building or in a field, charge your car when parked, and you have a much better and cheaper product. The solar panels on the building can also be used to power other things, unlike the car. It's such a stupid idea and will be very expensive to get custom panels for the car that aren't super fragile and also efficient. Just spend that money and larger cheap panels. This is purely to get VC funding and nothing more. It's a waste of time and energy.

[–] piccolo@sh.itjust.works 5 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

In america? Litterally everywhere. Even driving down the highway would get trickle charging.

If your expecting to fully charge from the panels, youre gonna have a bad day. But every extra mile would overcome the cost over its lifetime.

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Again, I said ideally. When will it ever outperform solar on a rooftop of the same size? How much more size could you get for the price?

It would never overcome its opportunity cost, even if it recovers it's cost (which you're speculating on and have no idea of the cost). You could spend the extra money for a solar car, or spend the money for rooftop solar. Rooftop solar will always outperform it for the price, so you have a negative opportunity cost.

[–] piccolo@sh.itjust.works 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Look at you owning a rooftop to put solar on.

A lot of americans are renters and that number is unfortunately growing.

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

The apartment I was last in was several stories tall and, as such, the parking lot was shaded most of the day. Most of the parking spaces were even in a parking garage, so they get no sunlight. If you're in an apartment, odds are this won't work for you either.

There are companies working on non-permanent balcony solar though, which isn't as good as rooftop but still something. That'll still only work for probably about half of apartments (facing east or west), but it's inexpensive.

We do need solutions for apartment dwellers, but a solar car probably isn't it. We need to require a certain amount of availability of electric charging at apartments, and we also need better public transportation options and bike Infrastructure. This is a gimmick solution, not a real solution.

[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

I mean, it'd be cool to get a couple miles of range here and there without having to plug in. Could make for a nice little errand vehicle in a smaller city where there aren't trees or tall buildings to block light and you just park in a driveway or apartment parking lot. If say the battery itself would be big enough for an 80 mile range, I could see some people never having to plug this car in.

It'll come down to price, of course. If it's cheap, it could be cool and useful. If it's expensive, it's a novelty and would have no practical reasoning to be purchased.

[–] Blaster_M@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

The base model has a 250mi range, and the biggest boi battery is estimated to get close to an 800mi range. The batteries are almost half the size of other EV batteries because of how efficient this vehicle is.

[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 2 weeks ago

That'll be super interesting if it ends up staying that way.

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 0 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

It will not be cheap. It's going to be the price of an EV + the price of custom shaped solar + the price of R&D + the price of being a niche product and not having the efficiency of scale. It'll be a novelty without any doubt.

[–] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Everything takes r and d. Also, it's not "custom solar panels" anymore if you're ordering 10,000 of them. The article stated that supposedly they have a ton of pre orders of sorts. Custom means a one off, or even a few dozen of something. Not thousands.

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 1 points 3 weeks ago

Everything requires R&D, but doing more things requires more R&D. It's not just an EV, which requires it's own R&D.

Custom means it has one purpose, not that it's a one-off. No one else will be using the same panels they will be, so they don't benefit from the scale of mass-produced panels (and 10,000 is not a large number even if that's the number they have pre-ordered).