ngl I do hate this kind of nhilism in terms of democracy. Like I agree with that one quote from that greek guy which says that a democracy needs smart people, but democracy is the best system we've come up with that to a small extent, makes politicians meet the peoples needs.

[–] VoxAliorum@lemmy.ml 19 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Electoralism =\= Democracy

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 15 points 6 days ago (1 children)

The problem isn't democracy, it's democracy under capitalism, and the idea that we can actually transition to socialism via electoralist means.

[–] PearOfJudes@lemmy.ml 0 points 1 day ago (1 children)

But its about working with the system we have. We can always advocate for the system being not broken, but intentionally taking advantage of minorities and increasing wealth for the rich whilst doing the opposite for the poor.

Even though I agree that any democracy in the west isn't truly democratic, with outright bribery in the form of lobbyist, and a two party duopoly. Even though I acknowledge this, everyone must vote for the less bad party, whilst also spreading the word for what they would truly want.

Even if the system is inevitably going downhill, slowing it down and pushing every means, through voting for the less evil option, and protesting, spreading word about socialism is the best option.

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 1 points 22 hours ago* (last edited 21 hours ago)

No, the best option is to organize directly and agitate against the system. This historically has protected marginalized groups far better, it's how the Civil Rights movement passed. Simply "spreading the word" about socialism does absolutely nothing about the existing levers of power we can and cannot pull, we must do so in the context of broader organizing.

[–] Strawberry@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 6 days ago (1 children)

The ancient greeks did not consider electoralism to be democracy. They used a combination of direct democracy and sortition. And it should be apparent now that they were right, and we've been played for fools for 200 years by the capitalist class who holds all of the true power in our states.

[–] PearOfJudes@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

The ancient Greeks are by no means someone to look for in terms of democracy. Aristotle believed slaves were naturally less human and needed masters, and they didn't let women, or those who didn't own land vote.

[–] Strawberry@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 12 hours ago

You could say this about all western "democracies"