this post was submitted on 30 Oct 2025
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I got a question, theory understander: In a post-state, post-collectivization society, what stops class structures and petty states from forming again, even if at small scale at first? I know this sounds a little close to the but human nature argument, but humor me. Is it that it lacks the conditions, like scarcity, for them to happen at all, or is the gist that it might as well happen, but it's them against literally everyone?
The state as defined by Marxists, is all functioning parts of the apparartus existing to prevent the outbreak of class war
after a proletarian revolution, the proles become the oppressing class, forcing their will upon the minorty (the bourgiouse). In theory, after a series of revolutions engulf the globe, the state becomes unnecessary, and begins to wither away
when the conditions that preclude class war exist, the state is no longer necessary, though this will not happen at once
in the USSR, under the New Economic Policy, the CPSU did have to allow some forms of capitalist industry to exist within their borders
I suppose for a 'small scale' state to re emerge there would need to be some catastrophy, a re-emfocement of compolsary monogamy for women, and a re-consolidation of wealth
the answer you seek lies within the origin of the family, private property and the state https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/download/pdf/origin_family.pdf
the beginning of state and revolution is an easier read and contains some of the same information, transgender warriors touches on some of this as well
our dear comrade cowbee's answer is better than mine <3
Thank you (and Cowbee). I'll give the books a listen 🫡
You might find it comfier if you go through my list, but add Origin of the Family, Private Property, and the State to the Scientific Socialism section.
Great comment, comrade!
It's more that the basis of private property is material relations and development giving rise to it, and the state exists to protect that. In collectivized society, where production and distribution are planned, there's simply no basis to create a new state or new private property, there's no utility in it whatsoever and no underlying basis for it.
How does a collectivised society plan or make big decisions without a state to make the decisions for them?
The state and administration aren't necessarily the same thing, which is why I tend to stress the difference between collectivized and communalized production. Collectivized production requires the infrastructure of complex planning.
What is administration under communism? What would that look like?
A good preview is looking at socialist states currently, but with fully collectivized production and distribution globally, no borders, and no oppressive forces like police to enforce property rights. It's not that the state is killed, but that it withers due to becoming superfluous.
What socialist states don't have police? I china, Vietnam and Cuba all seams to have police.
Yes, as they have class struggle and haven't reached communism. Once production is fully collectivized does class disappear, and then the state becomes superfluous. Until then, it's necessary.
When you ask a marxism question and the answer is material conditions
In another wording, present levels of development suit private property more than public property for many industries, and in some areas cooperative ownership works well for agriculture. Building up productive forces ti higher levels of complexity and larger scales makes public ownership and planning more effective. In communist society, these lower levels of development simply do not exist, and thus the basis for earlier property relations doesn't exist. It's like asking why feudal kingdoms don't crop up anymore.