this post was submitted on 21 Sep 2024
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Actual autist here: Took me a loooong time to figure out a whole bunch of social concepts when it comes to what neurotypicals basically deem as small talk.
Firstly, you basically just have to accept that for most people, a level of classist, racist, other kinds of stereotypical insults are socially viewed as basically acceptable, even though its usually quite obvious they are, in fact, insults.
Then you have to understand the concept of proportionality in small talk. You have to reply with something that's very obviously and directly relevant, and of the same magnitude.
(Jumping from an insult about dietary preferences to an insult about war crimes is not the same magnitude)
Encapsulating this entire social interaction is the setting: coworkers of mixed nationality likely and an after work dinner likely implies an expectation of basically corporate social etiquette, ie, back handed compliments to establish a social dominance hierarchy, where the name of the game us getting as close to breaching the invisible 'wow what an asshole' line without actually stepping over it.
To avoid looking meek, docile, awkward or antisocial, you have to figure out an appropriate small talk style reply, which actually requires a fairly detailed knowledge of the other persons you are conversing with. Their culture, personal history, personal beliefs, etc.
If you don't do this at least semi-regularly, then you are a pushover who will be given higher workloads with no extra compensation and likely will not advance very far in your career, as you seem to be fine where you are.
So ok, if you know a bit about Israelis, you might attempt to insult back along the lines of dietary preferences.
But, its a faux pas to escalate even within this realm of responses: If you retort that you 'prefer your potatoes with pork', well, that's probably going to be viewed as quite rude, as that's still a higher magnitude, as it references something that is commonly known to be forbidden to most Israelis.
What might be a proportional response would be 'Sorry, I'd make them (the potatoes) into latkes for you, but I don't have any eggs'.
But that may still be deemed as overly offensive, depending on the temperament of the Israeli and the level to which the other coworkers feel the need to be defensive toward perceived anti-semitism.
So, as an autistic person, you have to consciously have all this knowledge and think through it all logically in real time, all while your actual emotion is anger because you don't give a fuck that the potato comment was supposed to be a joke, because it was in actuality a racist insult that actually references a fucking famine and a dietary stereotype that exists largely due to imperialist exploitation of your ancestors.
In summary, yeah small talk is an absolute nightmare for autistic people who are in an aggressive, hostile social environment, which, at least in my experience, is almost all of them.
I bid that non autistic people be named and categorized in a way that highlights their subtly hostile, backstabbing, cruel nature. You know, the common household "psychopath" who doesn't actually meet the requirements for real psychopathy, but is still pathologically a dickish cynic playing a social game for minor wins in wealth and status, instead of simply being a friendly and polite contributor to society.
They named us.
Maybe we should name them.
Describe the traits that define them. Go into detail about what exactly is so wrong with them. Why they ~~kill~~ rally for warmongers. Why they sabotage eachother. Why they face obvious long term problems with such oblivious nonchalance.
Are you sure you’re “autistic”? Are you sure you’re not just a fucking asshole?
In exaggerating a little, but to me it's pretty fucking clear you have some issues of your own. Not exclusively, but definitely as common tendencies.
I don't know how deep the rabbit hole goes, but the less distinct pathologies of the common clay are certainly also much less explored. The plains lying between the tallest peaks and deepest, darkest caves, left comparably undisturbed. The resting place of the explorers, disinterested in undermining their own camp.
There are variations of normal, some whose defined traits might be even less charitable that those described in the definition of the prototypical autist.
Yeah, I'm angry and even violently so, but not out of a hatred of a group. I think OP's boss is an asshole, and I think Israel are not the good guys right now, but I also think antisemitism is no better and I don't want anyone innocent, like children, getting caught in the crossfire like they were during the Holocaust and like they are being today in Gaza.
…what?
Sorry, can you explain how you think children died in the Holocaust because of crossfire?
Okay, that's cherrypicking. I am not saying it was crossfire like any Jews deserved to die, they didn't. I'm saying that anyone calling children "just collateral damage" is evil, because THAT'S what I meant by crossfire, "they are not just collateral damage, you CHOSE not to care that your actions might hurt innocents".
If they are, in fact, collateral casualties to a military action, why is that “evil”?
Doesn’t that depend on whether the military conflict itself is justified? If Ukraine strikes a Russian weapons depo and it unbeknownst to them happens to be Take Your Vatnik to Work day, they’re likely to wipe out at least a couple of families. Is that truly “evil”? Isn’t that just an unfortunate tragedy in an ongoing tragedy called “war”?
I don't doubt they're autistic.
I also don't understand why you think they're an asshole. Allistic people often do act like low tier psychopaths: manipulative, selfish, overconfident and hypocritical.
It's just that they do this in ways they don't perceive, such that they don't recognize it until it crosses a more extreme threshold.
Here's a ... perhaps more palatable version of the same idea:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cZiR4o6j4HY&pp=ygUyd2hhdCBhbGxpc3RpYyBwZW9wbGUgc291bmQgbGlrZSB0byBhdXRpc3RpYyBwZW9wbGU%3D
And if you'd like to know more:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ugQEiZG19Rs&pp=ygU_d2hhdCBpZiBhbGxpc3RpYyBwZW9wbGUgd2VyZSBwYXRob2xvZ2l6ZXMgdGhlIHdheSBhdXRpc3RpY3MgYXJl
All human beings have the capability to act this way, including autistic humans. When you say “well, but these other guys are just like that” that’s when you should suspect you’re being an asshole.
Ok so you don't seem to know much about psychology.
Sure, in an extremely broad sense, all humans have the capability to act in any way.
When certain groups of people actually do, repeatedly act in certain ways more often than others do, when its so commonplace to them that other people have to point out that they are behaving that way because they do not even realize it, now you have the beginnings of how to classify people psychologically.
If we all have the theoretical, idealized capacity to violently assault and murder random animals with no provocation or explanation... super. Great.
How about the people that actually do that regularly?
You can't do any kind if psychological screening or differentiation or descriptors whatsoever if your entire theory is 'well technically anybody can do anything, so everyone is the same'.
This is like 11th grade debate club sophistry you're pushing here.
But they don’t, and in any case that’s not “psychology.” That’s just you being a bigoted fucking asshole.
Isn’t that literally the described experience of being autistic? Having your behavior pointed out to you and you didn’t even realize you were doing it? Constantly?
Is that something you think is true about neurotypical people? That we’re constantly “assaulting and murdering”?
How is this not you just being a giant gaping asshole? You can wrap it up in therapy terms if you want but surely you have to see how offensive this is?