this post was submitted on 29 Sep 2023
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[–] BlemboTheThird@lemmy.ca 18 points 2 years ago (15 children)

I'm gonna say some stuff that most of the people here probably know on some level, but considering this thread, I think it needs to be explicitly said.

Very few of the people who post comments on the internet are highly educated in whatever field they're making a claim in. Getting challenged by people who know next to nothing and receive all the upvotes anyway is an exhausting experience, so many well-educated people keep their debates private. If they are here, you probably aren't enough of an expert to recognize them. The simple, easy to understand takes are what get upvoted, and in-depth, nuanced ideas are almost always ignored or ridiculed. Most forums are full of people who know just enough to feel confident in making calls for radical action without any knowledge of how that action could be implemented or would play out.

Look through this comment section. Lots of vague, single-sentence arguments about being "capitalist," "communist," or "socialist," along with "leftist," "liberal," or "conservative," but I don't see a single one acknowledging that each of those words can individually encompass vast groups of conflicting ideas and have wildly different meanings in different parts of the world; a serious problem considering at least a few of the people posting in this thread aren't in the US. Very little discussion of substantive ideas like "people should be given a universal basic income of $15 a day," or "food stamps should be granted without application to anyone under a certain income threshold," or "social media servers should receive public funding and be administrated by an elected body." It's almost never more specific than "universal healthcare," or "abolish the police," Those might be the right direction, but when was the last time you saw people discussing things like whether experimental treatments should be covered, or the number and type of professions that should replace the current myriad of roles police are expected to fill? I seriously doubt if you randomly selected two self-described communists (or whatever ideology) on Lemmy and had them start making decisions together, that they would agree with each other on exactly how society should be run even half the time.

I'm not saying these conversations shouldn't happen, vague as they are. I certainly don't have the energy to write out long arguments 99% of the time. We all have to make our own way to finding deeper knowledge, and building a knowledge base of buzzwords can be a useful stepping stone. But far too often people stop once they feel they have a sufficient understanding of the buzzwords and then start talking like they know the answers. it's important to temper the depth of your convictions based on where you're having the discussion, where you're getting your knowledge. Are you watching youtube videos and reading unsourced comments, or are you reading research papers from institutions with a history of making accurate claims? Are you reading news articles from ad-supported papers, and if you are, are you checking whether those articles are making sources available for readers check on? Should I have bothered writing several paragraphs under a meme of a glowing red bird, and am I really qualified to tell people to be more careful with their discussions?

[–] ImplyingImplications@lemmy.ca 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I appreciated your wall of text! Lemmy, and social media in general, are pretty terrible places for nuanced discussion. The system is biased towards short and vauge posts. As you said though, they can be a good stepping stone.

There's been more than one time that I've seen people arguing in a thread and decided I'd look up the topic to see who is right. In the end it doesn't really matter what people in the thread were saying. It got me interested in the topic and I searched out more reputable sources of information and hopefully I learned a bit!

That being said, there are also threads where people post insane takes. You really need to have a litmus test for whether or not a post should even been considered.

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[–] TurboDiesel@lemmy.world 17 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (3 children)

Lemmy isn't "too extreme," a very small subset of Lemmings are just fucking insufferable.

[–] clearedtoland@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago (5 children)

…have these people met certain redditors? 🧐

[–] dudewitbow@lemmy.ml 15 points 2 years ago (1 children)

News: People on the internet find out some people on the internet grinds their gears

[–] funkajunk@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Tune in at 6 to hear our top story: "Water, is it really wet?". Findings from top scientist may surprise you. 🤔

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[–] foggy@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (12 children)

I mean, tankies are kinda worse.

Edit: seems this post is controversial! Let me clarify.

Tankies are definitely worse. 🥂

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[–] Touching_Grass@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago (7 children)

I actually hope more middle ground right leaning people migrate.

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[–] saltesc@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

There is a lot of political and other "adult" discourse. Not extreme, but more exhausting for a person wanting memes, gifs, and lols. I imagine the median age here is higher than that of Reddit. Can't confirm, but it certainly conducts itself with less..."juvenility"...or some word.

[–] ed_cock@feddit.de 4 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I find the political discourse, at least on some topics, very juvenile on Lemmy. You know, screeching about how billionaires aren't people but parasites and need to die, hundreds of upvotes. That's some edgy, frustrated teenager bullshit. Or at least it should be, guess some people never got the memo about inalienable rights, equal treatment, vigilantism and how two wrongs don't make a right.

Seriously, this thirst for blood is disturbing and if it isn't just venting then, well, look how the French Revolution turned on people. That wasn't very poggers.

There's also this idea that everybody who isn't 100% on board needs to be defooed and marked, preferably as a fascist. Which plays into the hands of the actual fascists because the non-fascists hate each other too much to collectively tell them to fuck off, despite their differences.

There, that's my venting done for today.

[–] SkankHunt4269@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Fuck leftists.

[–] Amends1782@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 years ago

Cancer post, glad people are calling it out. Some of you need to get off the internet a bit more.

[–] JokeDeity@lemm.ee 1 points 2 years ago (2 children)

True. Reddit was pretty center-right oriented. Lemmy leans more left and I do enjoy seeing the Trumpers here getting dunked on pretty frequently.

[–] applejacks@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Reddit was pretty center-right oriented.

lmao

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[–] Surp@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

Lol lemmy is just as corrupt as reddit. I've seen so many agendas on both sides pushed lately it's hilarious you think this is only leftys.

[–] n3m37h@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 2 years ago

Be a centrist or GTFO

[–] stratoscaster@lemmy.zip 1 points 2 years ago

Who tf cares? Tired of seeing braindead takes that people double down on

[–] CarterDarter@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Reddit is the most leftist platform I've used since Twitter (not X) lol

I think the only conservative spaces were the ones constantly getting banned or shunned... and DankMemes 😂

[–] SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 years ago (3 children)

I wouldn't say it's leftist, though there's a lot of leftists here. Lemmy is more like how internet discussion boards used to be. There's a lot of people with weird opinions on things, and there's no Reddit Karma pushing people to conform to the consensus. So people are going to have weird takes on things, and there's not 1000 comments upvoted above the weird ones, so you're going to see comments like that. So reply to with you your weird opinions on those weird comments.

Welcome to the version internet that's not pre-packaged and filtered to be bland!

[–] redcalcium@lemmy.institute 2 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I don't mind weird and different opinions on things. In fact, that's what make the discussion interesting instead of some boring echo chambers. I just wish people wouldn't be so aggressive about it and hurling personal attacks left and right. The old discussion board had thing called netiquete to keep the discussion civil, but here in certain communities it's like the wild west.

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[–] WiseThat@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Exactly. It's not "Leftist", it's just NOT fully of Nazis, and that's how far our standards have slipped.

[–] Flumsy@feddit.de 2 points 2 years ago

Thats a huge downplay of what the actual Nazis did if you refer to right-leaning people as that.

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[–] frowningfrog@lemm.ee 1 points 2 years ago

Unnecessary.

[–] Batpool23@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

Same coin dude, how about be an independent thinker.

[–] papalonian@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

Garbo post. What is meant by "actually" leftist? Does Reddit make any claims to being leftist that it's failing to back up? Why does your source of memes and internet titties need to align with your views in every way? Are you incapable of existing outside of an echo chamber?

[–] Gamey@feddit.de 1 points 2 years ago

You are on Lemmy.world pal, I left that instance because it's too neo liberal and right leaning for my taste... Are you by any chance a american because unless you post in Lemmy.ml all the time I can't really imagine that from a european perspective! If you count the facists from Hexbear and Lemmingrad that you instance defederated from as left (which they really aren't by the original definition of the left/right devide) it might be but I think unless you try to spill neo liberal garbage the backlash will probably be limited tbh!

[–] Whyherro@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (8 children)

Why does everything need to be politicized? No one gives a flying fuck if you're a leftist, unless you're a Leftist and no one gives a fuck if you're a right winger unless you're a right winger. Jesus christ the US Politics are absolute fucking cancer.

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